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DotNetNuke Forums
 
  Forum  General DotNetN...  Make it Hot! ( ...  Skin off your back...
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New Post 1/11/2008 2:09 PM
User is offline Josh Martin
157 posts
www.dnnreactor.com
9th Ranked


Re: Skin off your back... 

 Joseph Sak wrote

I'm a bit appalled that DNN is "open-source" but if you want to add functionality or get new skins you have to pay money for them. If you use WordPress or Drupal you can get tons of plugins and skins for free and the best part about wordpress themes is that people actually take time to make really nice good designs AND code them to be W3C and 508 compliant whereas on snowcovered you can buy terrible designs that are still coded in tables and other garbage.

I'm just the normal newbie learning to skin right now.  I can't express my frusteration with someone who would say they are "appalled" by people who are charging for thier hard work.  ASP.NET is a free framework from microsoft, are you also appauled that people charge for programs they have written in .NET ?

 

Anyhow, I would like to officially thank all the poeple who do post here, free of charge, and provide advice and solutions out of the kindness of thier hearts.

On that note.  You can watch me learn to skin at my site www.martinwebhosting.com

Thanks

Josh

 


Josh Martin
 
New Post 1/11/2008 2:32 PM
User is offline lance
91 posts
10th Ranked


Re: Skin off your back... 
Modified By lance  on 1/11/2008 6:37:25 PM)

A good skin doesn't require VS, no.  I have proven (IMHO) this a few times.  However, to get the control over the content to the point that allows a truly robust skinning environment, you need to get dirty with how dnn is constructed (IE DNN designer skin editor or VB script to insert print style sheets).  I'm am hobbled many times by the limitations of the presentation layer. 

For instance, look at the automatically created, nested elements required to post a piece of text....

-Skipping skin elements-
#dnn_contentpane
  - some type of container like a table or div -
    #dnn_ctr###_Contentpane
      #dnn_ctr###_ModuleContent
        #dnn_ctr###_HtmlModule_lblContent .Normal
          Content

Finding that content in the DOM is effectively futile as the IDs aren't known outside .net. Transversing from a known ID is problematic at best.  You have to make your own IDs in the content and that is out of the question for a skin package.

Compared to Joomla:
-Skipping skin elements-
#container
  #content
    #main-content
      .contentpaneopen
        Content

The known structure means I can target the content with both CSS and JS.  VS would allow me to target them but now I'm inside VS.

I could be wrong however and if anyone has a good, generic way to reach content via the DOM, please let me know.

As to the free repository, would it not make sense for DNN to champion it?  www.dotnetnuke.com is where most people are going to start so why not?  To date, there are zero free items in marketplace.  To get free things you have to hunt through the forums. The core and modules are free of course..  However, they are controlled by corp (as they should be) which limits innovation. 

 
New Post 1/12/2008 6:14 AM
User is offline Salaro Golestanian
892 posts
www.salaro.com
7th Ranked




Re: Skin off your back... 

Most good developers and skinners that make money from DNN echo system, also provide free stock for those that cannot afford it. However, the professional community does needs to earn money too, so to be able to provide consistent and reliable product and services to the community and support them as DNN upgrades. There is absolutely nothing wrong with charging for the products and services built on Open Source ethos.


There are many programmers and developers that have regular 9-5 jobs with bandwidth to produce skins and modules for free, do so for various personal reasons and their work is well appreciated by the community. But most do not maintain it or offer free support. There are exceptions to this statement, I am sure. But the beauty of this community is for every type of provider to be able to co-exist without slander or inappropriate accusations. If a product is either too expensive or inadequate in one’s eyes, then don’t buy it. If you find something that is free and meets your requirements the only thing you can do is to thank the developer and advertise the excellent work you have seen here in the forums.


Salar


SalarO

 
New Post 1/12/2008 6:48 AM
User is offline peter schotman
301 posts
www.dotnetnuke-websites.nl
8th Ranked




Re: Skin off your back... 

 Salaro Golestanian wrote: the beauty of this community is for every type of provider to be able to co-exist without slander or inappropriate accusations. If a product is either too expensive or inadequate in one’s eyes, then don’t buy it. If you find something that is free and meets your requirements the only thing you can do is to thank the developer and advertise the excellent work you have seen here in the forums.

Well said Salar, I think that complaining or ranting about others not do the "right" thing, does not help very much.

Peter


Peter Schotman
Cestus Websites voor DotNetNuke oplossingen in Nederland
Contact us for your custom design and skinning work.
 
New Post 1/14/2008 10:45 AM
User is offline Joseph Sak
106 posts
www.joesak.com
9th Ranked


Re: Skin off your back... 

OK I spoke a little fast when I said I was apalled at the idea of charging for modules but I tried to clear the air and I'll try to do so again.

It's not a big deal that they cost money. People should take reward for their work. The problem is the actual work. The code in most paid-for modules is pretty atrocious on the front end. And you can blame tools like VS all day but that is no excuse for someone who is a programmer. If you're going to make profit from your work, then really put pride into it and create something that is beautifully coded and works well on the back and front end. Take the time to learn all aspects of your application, not just the developer side.

Back end developers who create modules / apps that require front end code should either work with a well-versed front end programmer or learn the correct front-end code themselves. IDEs like VS should not be writing your front-end for you. It's outdated and not very friendly for the client-side crew. So, again, if you want to make money from it, then invest the time to learn the other half of your module's code.

 
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